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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 0:58:06 GMT -5
Alright just wondering would you guys want another force user battle next or non force user battle. Or perhaps force user vs non force user? Just wondering I got ideas for all 3  also had a decent idea for a small team based battle. |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:59:06 GMT -5
Alright just wondering would you guys want another force user battle next or non force user battle. Or perhaps force user vs non force user? Just wondering I got ideas for all 3 also had a decent idea for a small team based battle. Maybe try non force users this time since the last three have been force users. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 1:00:39 GMT -5
Yeah every established source shows he walks. I actually think he would have trouble running with mech legs.
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 1:02:56 GMT -5
Yeah every established source shows he walks. I actually think he would have trouble running with mech legs. What's with the malgus gif? |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 1:03:36 GMT -5
Alright just wondering would you guys want another force user battle next or non force user battle. Or perhaps force user vs non force user? Just wondering I got ideas for all 3 also had a decent idea for a small team based battle. Maybe try non force users this time since the last three have been force users. Alright I had a few ideas. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 1:04:18 GMT -5
Yeah every established source shows he walks. I actually think he would have trouble running with mech legs. What's with the malgus gif? Idk why not? WHY DONT YOU HAVE A MALGUS GIF GENERAL KENBO? |
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 1:06:33 GMT -5
What's with the malgus gif? Idk why not? WHY DONT YOU HAVE A MALGUS GIF GENERAL KENBO?  |
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Post by Namialus on Jan 4, 2014 1:45:07 GMT -5
I know I said myself that TFU isn't canon, but we can still look at stuff like how characters in the game moved. In the first level, you play as Vader on Kashyyyk. You can't run. You can only walk. TFU was made recently. So that sort of debunks the whole cinematography idea. Same in battlefront which is a little older but still. Vader can only walk and his jumps... well... LOL .......he can fly........ |
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Post by Namialus on Jan 4, 2014 1:46:22 GMT -5
If Malgus appeared in the 80s he wouldn't have been half as powerful as he is now. If they made an epic Vader themed trailer that highlighted his awesomeness (the TOR trailers try to highlight Malgus' epicness) he would be very different.
We have two very different sources and they are unfair.
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Post by Namialus on Jan 4, 2014 1:50:52 GMT -5
You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus... So you're saying we ignore the movies. Ok then. I'm saying we understand the difference between a film made in the 70s using practical effects and actual people than a computer-generated advertisement that is meant to highlight the epic parts of a video game. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 2:06:58 GMT -5
Same in battlefront which is a little older but still. Vader can only walk and his jumps... well... LOL .......he can fly........ Levitate would probably be a better term. Plus it leaves him completely open to all forms of attack |
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Post by Pinda on Jan 4, 2014 6:22:09 GMT -5
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Post by bobafett590 on Jan 4, 2014 7:56:52 GMT -5
Yeah why did George think of 80% probably BS he thought of on the spot with no backup info. Did he take everything into consideration? Or did he get the deadliest warrior guys too put it into a highly advanced sim of something? NO so how did he come up with 80%? Well where did he even say that? Does anyone have a link to it? Ah, let me quote that again"However, after all of his limbs were severed and he was extremely burned on Mustafar he lost much of his Force potential. As Darth Vader, Skywalker was believed to have had roughly 80% of the strength of the Emperor. Had he sustained none of his injuries on Mustafar he would have been twice as powerful." |
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Post by bobafett590 on Jan 4, 2014 8:06:25 GMT -5
Maybe Vader got slower over time? After all, these comics on him take place mostly before TESB and ROTJ. And even if Vader is slow, he has more lightsaber skill and knowledge in the force. That's VERY ESSENTIAL to fighting. Much more than agility and strength. Palpatine is the greatest sith ever and he was strongest in those two categories. That means this'll help favor Vader even more. Also, as for GL canon, if he indeed said that Vader is 80% as powerful as Sidious in his suit, than those supporting Malgus have already lost. There's no way that Malgus is a higher percentile than that compared to Sidious. How do you even come up with a number like that? And where was it mentioned? To me it seems ridiculous even if it was actually said. Anakin could have became powerful if he didn't lose on Mustafar but he lost 2 of his legs and his last arm. Someone who's mortally wounded, even in a universe such as Star Wars, is going to have disabilities with a suit. Malgus also knows a lot about lightsaber skills and knowledge of the force. He's killed many jedi and can do things Vader can't like lightning. I still don't really understand how people think Vader to be this all powerful guy. He was feared in the Imperial era because there was basically no one to challenge him and the Empire for a long time, and you can't say he's powerful just because "he's the Chosen One". Him being the Chosen One meant he'd bring balance to the force. It didn't mean he was the most powerful force user of all time. Vader is a disabled man with his suit and, like others said, is slow. A great comparison of a duel involving Vader compared to one with Malgus would be to look at these two videos. There's a MAJOR difference. There is one moment in ESB when Vader leaps into the air and quite gracefully and lands on his feet at the bottom of a long staircase in Bespin. That one moment, alone, is enough for me to believe that Vader has at least some hidden (to the movie audience) dexterity. Descriptions and demostartions of Vader's saber and force skills (Again, all canon): "The lightsaber hadn't been there, and then it was, and the lightsaber was a blur. Vader moved without seeming to move, and the lightsaber sliced into Roan, straight into his chest. Straight into his heart." s1349.photobucket.com/user/Intrepid37/media/Darth%20Vader/blz12_zpsb5cefa03.jpg.html |
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Post by bobafett590 on Jan 4, 2014 8:07:25 GMT -5
It's complete folly that you just disregard EU, arguably one of the most important parts of Star Wars, for your own convenience as well as some other Vader arguments for the reason that they refer to EU.
Malgus is an EU character.
Vader is not.
So we must use EU-Enhanced Vader (Completely CANON) to make this a fair argument.
Obviously, lots of you are voting Magus because of the Deceived or Hope Trailers that make Malgus look cool, because otherwise you would have noticed that Malgus' feats are nothing compared to Vader's, (As explained in lots of posts by people supporting Vader)
Lightsaber Abilities: Vader was unmatched in lightsaber combat for more than 20 years, and used his form to kill 8 Jedi Knights/Masters at a time
Force Powers: Malgus, but Vader can block or deflect them
Endurance: Vader
Simply put, Malgus has nothing on Vader, the fact that lots of Pro-Malgus Arguments have been rendered obsolete means there is no reason to vote Malgus.
Of course this below isn't exactly relevant to this but....
The Best and Original Star Wars Villain>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.Some balderdash Bioware made up
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you haven't already, go back through all the Vader arguments, (without ignoring perfectly valid EU evidence) and you'll see Vader wins by a landslide.
Some of the bigger, more detailed arguments start on page 10/page 11 onwards, before that it's mainly just statements
And to any Malgus supporter please tell me every reason why you think Malgus would win and put them into one post.
VADER 80% AS POWERFUL AS PALPATINE QUOTE FROM GL:
"However, after all of his limbs were severed and he was extremely burned on Mustafar he lost much of his Force potential. As Darth Vader, Skywalker was believed to have had roughly 80% of the strength of the Emperor. Had he sustained none of his injuries on Mustafar he would have been twice as powerful."
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 9:32:10 GMT -5
I'm basically just sayin that if vice versa, the Malgus trailer was made in the 80s, it wouldn't have glorified Malgus' powers as much. Just like I've been saying, cinematography glorifies it more in the past decade for visuals and action, etc. So you're saying Vader would beat Malgus because of cinematography? No, I'm just saying that a recently made video game will glorify its characters a little too much. Malgus is still powerful, don't get me wrong, it's just they might've overdone him a little bit for playability and looks. |
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Post by bobafett590 on Jan 4, 2014 9:33:40 GMT -5
Okay, Malgus-Supporters, please give me as many reasons as you can that prove that Malgus wins this because I'm not seeing lots of them and I'm a little confused. And if you want reasons why Vader wins, read Pg 10 onwards
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 9:41:43 GMT -5
It's complete folly that you just disregard EU, arguably one of the most important parts of Star Wars, for your own convenience as well as some other Vader arguments for the reason that they refer to EU. Malgus is an EU character. Vader is not. So we must use EU-Enhanced Vader (Completely CANON) to make this a fair argument. That is completely right. And Vader is shown to have killed many Jedi, most skilled, some not. It isn't fair to base him off three fights in the OT during the 70-80s while we base Malgus off a whole video game that's supposed to glorify its characters at least a little to make you want it more. If he had been in the movies, he probably only would've been the equivalent to Dooku or Maul. And this trailer is from 2011 onward, let me remind you, which in this time they like to make things like that more epic so Malgus will be even more powerful than if he was created in 80s. Malgus is completely EU too so we must consider EU Vader as well (the canon ones) otherwise you'll be basing a practical 1977-83 villain vs a 2011+ villain made in a super special effects trailer as video game. |
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Post by Namialus on Jan 4, 2014 12:22:55 GMT -5
If we're going to use games to defend Malgus, let's do the same for Vader.
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Post by Pinda on Jan 4, 2014 12:29:59 GMT -5
If we're going to use games to defend Malgus, let's do the same for Vader. We're not using gameplay mechanics. Only Malgus's story and what we've seen him do in cinematic trailers and cutscenes. In that game Vader is controlled by a player, if that player got himself killed all the time would that mean Vader was bad? No, because it's just a gameplay mechanic. |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 12:49:49 GMT -5
If Malgus appeared in the 80s he wouldn't have been half as powerful as he is now. If they made an epic Vader themed trailer that highlighted his awesomeness (the TOR trailers try to highlight Malgus' epicness) he would be very different. We have two very different sources and they are unfair. So now you've resorted to just defending Vader because the OT was made over 30 years ago. This is a battle about how these two fight, not when they were created. The Vader you see is the Vader you get, I can't stress that enough. Unless he's overwritten, which he most likely never will be, the Vader in the OT is Vader if you like it or not. So you're saying we ignore the movies. Ok then. I'm saying we understand the difference between a film made in the 70s using practical effects and actual people than a computer-generated advertisement that is meant to highlight the epic parts of a video game. Again, the only defense you have for him is the time he was created. So you're admitting that he's slow. Well where did he even say that? Does anyone have a link to it? Ah, let me quote that again"However, after all of his limbs were severed and he was extremely burned on Mustafar he lost much of his Force potential. As Darth Vader, Skywalker was believed to have had roughly 80% of the strength of the Emperor. Had he sustained none of his injuries on Mustafar he would have been twice as powerful." Where does this quote come from? And this quote still sounds sketchy. Using words like "Believed" and "Roughly" aren't saying it like it's a fact. And I'm still curious how a number like that could have been created. How do you even come up with a number like that? And where was it mentioned? To me it seems ridiculous even if it was actually said. Anakin could have became powerful if he didn't lose on Mustafar but he lost 2 of his legs and his last arm. Someone who's mortally wounded, even in a universe such as Star Wars, is going to have disabilities with a suit. Malgus also knows a lot about lightsaber skills and knowledge of the force. He's killed many jedi and can do things Vader can't like lightning. I still don't really understand how people think Vader to be this all powerful guy. He was feared in the Imperial era because there was basically no one to challenge him and the Empire for a long time, and you can't say he's powerful just because "he's the Chosen One". Him being the Chosen One meant he'd bring balance to the force. It didn't mean he was the most powerful force user of all time. Vader is a disabled man with his suit and, like others said, is slow. A great comparison of a duel involving Vader compared to one with Malgus would be to look at these two videos. There's a MAJOR difference. There is one moment in ESB when Vader leaps into the air and quite gracefully and lands on his feet at the bottom of a long staircase in Bespin. That one moment, alone, is enough for me to believe that Vader has at least some hidden (to the movie audience) dexterity. Descriptions and demostartions of Vader's saber and force skills (Again, all canon): "The lightsaber hadn't been there, and then it was, and the lightsaber was a blur. Vader moved without seeming to move, and the lightsaber sliced into Roan, straight into his chest. Straight into his heart." s1349.photobucket.com/user/Intrepid37/media/Darth%20Vader/blz12_zpsb5cefa03.jpg.html"Vader moved without seeming to move" Do I need to pull up one of his movie duels again? All of you are ignoring them just because they were made in the 70s and 80s. You can't ignore part of the character like you're doing. It's complete folly that you just disregard EU, arguably one of the most important parts of Star Wars, for your own convenience as well as some other Vader arguments for the reason that they refer to EU. Malgus is an EU character. Vader is not. So we must use EU-Enhanced Vader (Completely CANON) to make this a fair argument. Obviously, lots of you are voting Magus because of the Deceived or Hope Trailers that make Malgus look cool, because otherwise you would have noticed that Malgus' feats are nothing compared to Vader's, (As explained in lots of posts by people supporting Vader) Lightsaber Abilities: Vader was unmatched in lightsaber combat for more than 20 years, and used his form to kill 8 Jedi Knights/Masters at a time Force Powers: Malgus, but Vader can block or deflect them Endurance: Vader Simply put, Malgus has nothing on Vader, the fact that lots of Pro-Malgus Arguments have been rendered obsolete means there is no reason to vote Malgus. Of course this below isn't exactly relevant to this but.... The Best and Original Star Wars Villain>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.Some balderdash Bioware made up ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you haven't already, go back through all the Vader arguments, (without ignoring perfectly valid EU evidence) and you'll see Vader wins by a landslide. Some of the bigger, more detailed arguments start on page 10/page 11 onwards, before that it's mainly just statements And to any Malgus supporter please tell me every reason why you think Malgus would win and put them into one post. VADER 80% AS POWERFUL AS PALPATINE QUOTE FROM GL: "However, after all of his limbs were severed and he was extremely burned on Mustafar he lost much of his Force potential. As Darth Vader, Skywalker was believed to have had roughly 80% of the strength of the Emperor. Had he sustained none of his injuries on Mustafar he would have been twice as powerful." It's also even worse to just disregard the movies. You all are just ignoring the movies because of the time they were made. That is Vader, and that's the best look we've gotten of him. Obviously you are voting Vader because the EU comics make him look like a god. Unmatched for 20 years? Obi-Wan beat him on Mustafar and then just let himself die on the Death Star. Luke then beat him several years later on the second Death Star. And don't use the "he didn't want to hurt his son" excuse again. If he truly was better than Luke, he still could have held him off. And then also don't use the "Luke was the most powerful jedi that ever lived excuse" again. In ROTJ, he's still only a knight. And that's that. Vader cannot deflect all of Malgus' force abilities. Vader does not have endurance. He has cybernetic parts that slow him down. That's already been proven. And you not liking Malgus has nothing to do with the battle between him and Vader. So you're saying Vader would beat Malgus because of cinematography? No, I'm just saying that a recently made video game will glorify its characters a little too much. Malgus is still powerful, don't get me wrong, it's just they might've overdone him a little bit for playability and looks. And again, the best defense for Vader is the time he was created. Vader is showed as slow moving in every source material he's been shown in. |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 12:50:27 GMT -5
If we're going to use games to defend Malgus, let's do the same for Vader. Alright, if you want to use that game then we can also say that he was beaten by a 20 year old apprentice. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 13:19:22 GMT -5
What about that TFU 2 trailer that shows Starkiller force push Vader through about 10 walls? Because Vader would block every force attack right?
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Post by Namialus on Jan 4, 2014 14:10:57 GMT -5
What about that TFU 2 trailer that shows Starkiller force push Vader through about 10 walls? Because Vader would block every force attack right? Vader wasn't even hurt. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 14:20:43 GMT -5
What about that TFU 2 trailer that shows Starkiller force push Vader through about 10 walls? Because Vader would block every force attack right? Vader wasn't even hurt. Cause he has armour of course. But if it was a very thick wall that he couldn't go through then Vader would have still be off balance giving Starkiller the chance to get to him while he recovers. Point is people can't say Vader can block every force attack... When he can't even block the most basic one. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 14:21:51 GMT -5
Yeah every established source shows he walks. I actually think he would have trouble running with mech legs. What's with the malgus gif? It's gone now fool. That one was too big didnt really for into the signature this one is better  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2014 17:58:16 GMT -5
Like other people have said I don't really know a lot about Malgus but I definitely think he'd beat Vader. Vader isn't exactly that powerful in his suit. Malgus comes from the Old Republic era and is used to war and fighting while Vader rarely sees combat. Which vader era. Like when Vader hunts down all the jedi in his suit era or when he was old in return of the jedi. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 18:02:25 GMT -5
Hmm votes are tied. Someone that has not voted please start voting so we don't have too extend voting time and get this one done. *cough* bane Malgus *cough* |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2014 18:12:07 GMT -5
I feel like match ps like this can be very hard to work. Because of the era differences. Vader was only in the old movies and if you notice the fight were very toned down in them due to like budget reasons and the fights were crazy in the TOR and clone wars era because they had budget. If they made the original movies now I am sure the fights with vader would be more crazy. Also did people forget that Vader did destroy the jedi order. He attacked the temple and probably did crazy shit fights like malgus did in the temple fights. Vader took down many great jedi in the order. He became more powerful then even master yoda. The suit did weaken him but he still hunted down jedi. A new hope started like 16 years after the Revenge of sith so vader got really old by then. Don't forget that malgus has that weird ass breathing thing on him too. Also malgus doesn't have that powerful force lightning, he shocked his lightning at that officer guy at close range and it didn't do shit. Ya vader didn't have suit on during the temple attack but he did hunt down all the other jedi after the events.
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Post by Pinda on Jan 4, 2014 18:14:26 GMT -5
Well, since we're using games for this. In Battlefront 2 Vader is pretty slow, I mean he can use Force run to get faster but his lightsaber movement and walking is generally really slow.
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also had a decent idea for a small team based battle.
