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Post by Potato on Jan 3, 2014 23:34:10 GMT -5
Maybe Vader got slower over time? After all, these comics on him take place mostly before TESB and ROTJ. And even if Vader is slow, he has more lightsaber skill and knowledge in the force. That's VERY ESSENTIAL to fighting. Much more than agility and strength. Palpatine is the greatest sith ever and he was strongest in those two categories. That means this'll help favor Vader even more. Also, as for GL canon, if he indeed said that Vader is 80% as powerful as Sidious in his suit, than those supporting Malgus have already lost. There's no way that Malgus is a higher percentile than that compared to Sidious. How do you even come up with a number like that? And where was it mentioned? To me it seems ridiculous even if it was actually said. Anakin could have became powerful if he didn't lose on Mustafar but he lost 2 of his legs and his last arm. Someone who's mortally wounded, even in a universe such as Star Wars, is going to have disabilities with a suit. Malgus also knows a lot about lightsaber skills and knowledge of the force. He's killed many jedi and can do things Vader can't like lightning. I still don't really understand how people think Vader to be this all powerful guy. He was feared in the Imperial era because there was basically no one to challenge him and the Empire for a long time, and you can't say he's powerful just because "he's the Chosen One". Him being the Chosen One meant he'd bring balance to the force. It didn't mean he was the most powerful force user of all time. Vader is a disabled man with his suit and, like others said, is slow. A great comparison of a duel involving Vader compared to one with Malgus would be to look at these two videos. Vader: Malgus: There's a MAJOR difference. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 3, 2014 23:48:03 GMT -5
Yeah why did George think of 80% probably BS he thought of on the spot with no backup info. Did he take everything into consideration? Or did he get the deadliest warrior guys too put it into a highly advanced sim of something? NO so how did he come up with 80%?
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Post by Potato on Jan 3, 2014 23:49:41 GMT -5
Yeah why did George think of 80% probably BS he thought of on the spot with no backup info. Did he take everything into consideration? Or did he get the deadliest warrior guys too put it into a highly advanced sim of something? NO so how did he come up with 80%? Well where did he even say that? Does anyone have a link to it? |
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Post by Newan on Jan 3, 2014 23:55:33 GMT -5
Yeah why did George think of 80% probably BS he thought of on the spot with no backup info. Did he take everything into consideration? Or did he get the deadliest warrior guys too put it into a highly advanced sim of something? NO so how did he come up with 80%? Well where did he even say that? Does anyone have a link to it? I kinda want too know that now. And even if George said that it does not prove Vader wins the duel. Mace is less powerful than Palpatine technically but he still beat him with a lightsaber. Maul in theory had more training so he should have beat Obi Wan.... You can't use these kinda things to decide a duel. |
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Post by Potato on Jan 3, 2014 23:57:19 GMT -5
Well where did he even say that? Does anyone have a link to it? I kinda want too know that now. And even if George said that it does not prove Vader wins the duel. Mace is less powerful than Palpatine technically but he still beat him with a lightsaber. Maul in theory had more training so he should have beat Obi Wan.... You can't use these kinda things to decide a duel. Yeah, because I've never heard that quote from GL or anyone else before. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 0:11:50 GMT -5
I kinda want too know that now. And even if George said that it does not prove Vader wins the duel. Mace is less powerful than Palpatine technically but he still beat him with a lightsaber. Maul in theory had more training so he should have beat Obi Wan.... You can't use these kinda things to decide a duel. Yeah, because I've never heard that quote from GL or anyone else before. And I'm not sure GL would consider people's power levels when writing the script I can believe that Anakin had the potential to be twice as powerful as Palpatine if he didn't suffer injuries. But even then that means that any Sith that was a strong Jedi has more potential then Vader so Revan and Exar Kun are both great examples here and they would both crush Vader or Malgus. Also I like the new avatar  just wondering do you make them yourself or get them from the internet? |
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Post by Namialus on Jan 4, 2014 0:18:54 GMT -5
You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus...
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:19:38 GMT -5
Maybe Vader got slower over time? After all, these comics on him take place mostly before TESB and ROTJ. And even if Vader is slow, he has more lightsaber skill and knowledge in the force. That's VERY ESSENTIAL to fighting. Much more than agility and strength. Palpatine is the greatest sith ever and he was strongest in those two categories. That means this'll help favor Vader even more. Also, as for GL canon, if he indeed said that Vader is 80% as powerful as Sidious in his suit, than those supporting Malgus have already lost. There's no way that Malgus is a higher percentile than that compared to Sidious. How do you even come up with a number like that? And where was it mentioned? To me it seems ridiculous even if it was actually said. Anakin could have became powerful if he didn't lose on Mustafar but he lost 2 of his legs and his last arm. Someone who's mortally wounded, even in a universe such as Star Wars, is going to have disabilities with a suit. Malgus also knows a lot about lightsaber skills and knowledge of the force. He's killed many jedi and can do things Vader can't like lightning. I still don't really understand how people think Vader to be this all powerful guy. He was feared in the Imperial era because there was basically no one to challenge him and the Empire for a long time, and you can't say he's powerful just because "he's the Chosen One". Him being the Chosen One meant he'd bring balance to the force. It didn't mean he was the most powerful force user of all time. Vader is a disabled man with his suit and, like others said, is slow. A great comparison of a duel involving Vader compared to one with Malgus would be to look at these two videos. There's a MAJOR difference. Idk Boba got it from somewhere but I believe him that it's true that GL said it. And even if Vader is slow, does that even matter if you can still defeat someone because your stronger in the force. You can connect with it and use it to your advantage and summon strength from it. Vader didn't do it in the movies cause there wasn't a fight where he needed/wanted to. He could've with Obi-Wan, but didn't. He didnt have a real need to. As for Luke, he really didn't wish to kill his son, showing that there was still some good in him. And he is very powerful with his lightsbaer skills. |
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 0:22:20 GMT -5
You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus... why |
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:22:26 GMT -5
You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus... Exactly. If Vader were to appear in SW during the past 10 years, he would've been a much different fighter based on how films go. He probably would've deflected lightsabers with his hands, choked Jedi to death, and ran around kickin people and resisting Palpatine's lightening for days. It was very different then when effects and how films played out then made him appear weaker although he wasn't. |
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 0:23:47 GMT -5
You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus... Exactly. If Vader were to appear in SW during the past 10 years, he would've been a much different fighter based on how films go. He probably would've deflected lightsabers with his hands, choked Jedi to death, and ran around kickin people and resisting Palpatine's lightening for days. It was very different then when effects and how films played out then made him appear weaker although he wasn't. What? No no no... The Vader we saw is the Vader we get. He's more legit than some drawings... |
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:29:07 GMT -5
Exactly. If Vader were to appear in SW during the past 10 years, he would've been a much different fighter based on how films go. He probably would've deflected lightsabers with his hands, choked Jedi to death, and ran around kickin people and resisting Palpatine's lightening for days. It was very different then when effects and how films played out then made him appear weaker although he wasn't. What? No no no... The Vader we saw is the Vader we get. He's more legit than some drawings... Take Sidious for example. They could've made him so much more powerful and added more fighting scenes with him during ROTJ in 1983. But they didn't cause they didn't do that kinda stuff then. But in 2005 they make him much more better at fighting case that's what they do nowadays... |
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 0:31:08 GMT -5
What? No no no... The Vader we saw is the Vader we get. He's more legit than some drawings... Take Sidious for example. They could've made him so much more powerful and added more fighting scenes with him during ROTJ in 1983. But they didn't cause they didn't do that kinda stuff then. But in 2005 they make him much more better at fighting case that's what they do nowadays... Um no why would the Emperor do anything? He's old but more importantly he has people for that |
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:33:24 GMT -5
Take Sidious for example. They could've made him so much more powerful and added more fighting scenes with him during ROTJ in 1983. But they didn't cause they didn't do that kinda stuff then. But in 2005 they make him much more better at fighting case that's what they do nowadays... Um no why would the Emperor do anything? He's old but more importantly he has people for that The point is that nowadays, films like to include action when they can. So if ROTJ had been made in 2007, then Sidious would've resisted and fought Vader as Vader tried to kill him resulting in a bigger battle than one that would appear in a 1983 film. |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:34:04 GMT -5
Yeah, because I've never heard that quote from GL or anyone else before. And I'm not sure GL would consider people's power levels when writing the script I can believe that Anakin had the potential to be twice as powerful as Palpatine if he didn't suffer injuries. But even then that means that any Sith that was a strong Jedi has more potential then Vader so Revan and Exar Kun are both great examples here and they would both crush Vader or Malgus. Also I like the new avatar just wondering do you make them yourself or get them from the internet? The pictures are official Lego pictures of minifigures from sets. I choose minifigures that I think are cool.  You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus... So you're saying we ignore the movies. Ok then. What? No no no... The Vader we saw is the Vader we get. He's more legit than some drawings... Take Sidious for example. They could've made him so much more powerful and added more fighting scenes with him during ROTJ in 1983. But they didn't cause they didn't do that kinda stuff then. But in 2005 they make him much more better at fighting case that's what they do nowadays... Sidious in the PT was younger and needed to fight at least a little in order to destroy the jedi. In the OT the jedi are gone and he doesn't have to fight. And he was shown as powerful in ROTJ, he nearly completely fried Luke with lightning alone. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 0:35:44 GMT -5
Poll up ends tomorrow 5PM mountain. Next one will be up right after.
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 0:36:32 GMT -5
Though it's Saturday people may vote earlier if someone is up by 3 votes by 3ish I may just end it and out the next up. If it's close I won't.
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:36:53 GMT -5
And I'm not sure GL would consider people's power levels when writing the script I can believe that Anakin had the potential to be twice as powerful as Palpatine if he didn't suffer injuries. But even then that means that any Sith that was a strong Jedi has more potential then Vader so Revan and Exar Kun are both great examples here and they would both crush Vader or Malgus. Also I like the new avatar just wondering do you make them yourself or get them from the internet? The pictures are official Lego pictures of minifigures from sets. I choose minifigures that I think are cool. You guys can't use 1977 duels in comparison to Malgus... So you're saying we ignore the movies. Ok then. Take Sidious for example. They could've made him so much more powerful and added more fighting scenes with him during ROTJ in 1983. But they didn't cause they didn't do that kinda stuff then. But in 2005 they make him much more better at fighting case that's what they do nowadays... Sidious in the PT was younger and needed to fight at least a little in order to destroy the jedi. In the OT the jedi are gone and he doesn't have to fight. And he was shown as powerful in ROTJ, he nearly completely fried Luke with lightning alone. If ROTJ was made more recently, they would've made him actually fight with a lightsbaer cause that's what films like to do now. Take Beorn in the Hobbit for example. If that had been made in 1983, then they probably would've kept it more accurate to the book. But in 2013, they like more action so they'll make him attack the dwarves. |
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 0:38:19 GMT -5
The pictures are official Lego pictures of minifigures from sets. I choose minifigures that I think are cool. So you're saying we ignore the movies. Ok then. Sidious in the PT was younger and needed to fight at least a little in order to destroy the jedi. In the OT the jedi are gone and he doesn't have to fight. And he was shown as powerful in ROTJ, he nearly completely fried Luke with lightning alone. If ROTJ was made more recently, they would've made him actually fight with a lightsbaer cause that's what films like to do now. Take Beorn in the Hobbit for example. If that had been made in 1983, then they probably would've kept it more accurate to the book. But in 2013, they like more action so they'll make him attack the dwarves. If the writer was smart, he wouldn't have some old due engage in a mindless duel.... |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:39:25 GMT -5
The pictures are official Lego pictures of minifigures from sets. I choose minifigures that I think are cool. So you're saying we ignore the movies. Ok then. Sidious in the PT was younger and needed to fight at least a little in order to destroy the jedi. In the OT the jedi are gone and he doesn't have to fight. And he was shown as powerful in ROTJ, he nearly completely fried Luke with lightning alone. If ROTJ was made more recently, they would've made him actually fight with a lightsbaer cause that's what films like to do now. Take Beorn in the Hobbit for example. If that had been made in 1983, then they probably would've kept it more accurate to the book. But in 2013, they like more action so they'll make him attack the dwarves. None of this changes who Vader is anyway though. Like Kenobi said, the Vader you saw is the Vader you get. You can't just say that's not how he actually is because the movie was made in the 70s. |
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Post by Newan on Jan 4, 2014 0:42:46 GMT -5
This battle and the last one have had kinda a theme for them. Ventress and Maul - Both Sith Assassins/ independent in TCW. Vader and Malgus - Both similar, injuries, Killed lots of Jedi. Rather than just random characters.
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:43:05 GMT -5
If ROTJ was made more recently, they would've made him actually fight with a lightsbaer cause that's what films like to do now. Take Beorn in the Hobbit for example. If that had been made in 1983, then they probably would've kept it more accurate to the book. But in 2013, they like more action so they'll make him attack the dwarves. None of this changes who Vader is anyway though. Like Kenobi said, the Vader you saw is the Vader you get. You can't just say that's not how he actually is because the movie was made in the 70s. I know, but if Dooku and Vader switched movies try appeared in, ten Dooku would seem more like a weaker old dude, and Vader a very cool robotic sith. Just because of how cinematography goes. Same with Malgus. A 2011 trailer that's CGI and not in a movie will obviously portray him as a more powerful and stronger sith for two reasons. It's how things go in films these day (even though it isn't a film. It still applies roughly to that) and its a video game. They want him to appear very strong. Like Starkiller (who was terribly OP. wasn't he actually so OP that he was stronger than Sidious?) |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:46:15 GMT -5
None of this changes who Vader is anyway though. Like Kenobi said, the Vader you saw is the Vader you get. You can't just say that's not how he actually is because the movie was made in the 70s. I know, but if Dooku and Vader switched movies try appeared in, ten Dooku would seem more like a weaker old dude, and Vader a very cool robotic sith. Just because of how cinematography goes. Same with Malgus. A 2011 trailer that's CGI and not in a movie will obviously portray him as a more powerful and stronger sith for two reasons. It's how things go in films these day (even though it isn't a film. It still applies roughly to that) and its a video game. They want him to appear very strong. Like Starkiller (who was terribly OP. wasn't he actually so OP that he was stronger than Sidious?) Everyone being more energetic in duels prior to the OT makes sense. In the OT, the only duelists are, like I said before, an old man, a disabled man, and a jedi in training. Prior to that it makes total sense that the duels would be more complex because they happen more frequently between more active people. |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:46:33 GMT -5
Oh, and I don't think Force Unleashed's canon anymore.
Which is a good thing too, because it's totally ridiculous that Starkiller would beat Sidious. BTW Newan, I'd advise you not to have Starkiller as one of the duelists ever because the conversation would be really sketchy.
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:49:08 GMT -5
If ROTJ was made more recently, they would've made him actually fight with a lightsbaer cause that's what films like to do now. Take Beorn in the Hobbit for example. If that had been made in 1983, then they probably would've kept it more accurate to the book. But in 2013, they like more action so they'll make him attack the dwarves. If the writer was smart, he wouldn't have some old due engage in a mindless duel.... He could make it a good story. Vader gets wounded by Luke. Luke attacks Sidious (and is more powerful cause of cinematography these days). Force lightening by Sidious. Luke resists and goes on. Brief fight between two with lightsabers. Then more lightening and Vader saves Luke and the rest proceeds on like ROTJ as we know it. Those extra fight scenes would just be there to give more action and show that Sidious doesn't want to let Luke think he's in charge. |
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 0:50:37 GMT -5
If the writer was smart, he wouldn't have some old due engage in a mindless duel.... He could make it a good story. Vader gets wounded by Luke. Luke attacks Sidious (and is more powerful cause of cinematography these days). Force lightening by Sidious. Luke resists and goes on. Brief fight between two with lightsabers. Then more lightening and Vader saves Luke and the rest proceeds on like ROTJ as we know it. Those extra fight scenes would just be there to give more action and show that Sidious doesn't want to let Luke think he's in charge. No they are showing that the Emperor does not get his hands dirty. He has people for every job we hardly see him. Just starting to fight someone would be out of character |
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Post by Star on Jan 4, 2014 0:50:53 GMT -5
I'm basically just sayin that if vice versa, the Malgus trailer was made in the 80s, it wouldn't have glorified Malgus' powers as much. Just like I've been saying, cinematography glorifies it more in the past decade for visuals and action, etc.
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:52:17 GMT -5
I'm basically just sayin that if vice versa, the Malgus trailer was made in the 80s, it wouldn't have glorified Malgus' powers as much. Just like I've been saying, cinematography glorifies it more in the past decade for visuals and action, etc. So you're saying Vader would beat Malgus because of cinematography? |
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Post by Potato on Jan 4, 2014 0:55:58 GMT -5
I know I said myself that TFU isn't canon, but we can still look at stuff like how characters in the game moved. In the first level, you play as Vader on Kashyyyk. You can't run. You can only walk. TFU was made recently. So that sort of debunks the whole cinematography idea.
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Post by Kenbo on Jan 4, 2014 0:57:35 GMT -5
I know I said myself that TFU isn't canon, but we can still look at stuff like how characters in the game moved. In the first level, you play as Vader on Kashyyyk. You can't run. You can only walk. TFU was made recently. So that sort of debunks the whole cinematography idea. Same in battlefront which is a little older but still. Vader can only walk and his jumps... well... LOL |
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just wondering do you make them yourself or get them from the internet?
it’s been quite a while. I’ve been pretty good, how about yourself? 