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Post by bane on Dec 26, 2015 20:37:19 GMT -5
Honestly no I don't think it's Plagueis. In the books he died before Sidious became chancellor. (the night before actually) Plus, the new movies don't seem to be working off any characters in the books in the first place. Plagueis is a movie character though. And Sidious thinks he killed him... but we know Plagueis could manipulate life/death... so we don't know if he truly died. Also, the book is no longer canon so we don't know anything about how Plagueis died. Also, some ideas and characters for TFA were based on the Expanded Universe (or so I heard). Honestly no I don't think it's Plagueis. In the books he died before Sidious became chancellor. (the night before actually) Plus, the new movies don't seem to be working off any characters in the books in the first place. He's mentioned in Episode 3, given little to nothing on him, yet he was Sidious's master, I think it's entirely plausible for him to make an appearance. I know he died but, is it possible for him to have escaped death? I forgot he was mentioned a tiny bit.  But even though he was mentioned, it doesn't make his death in the books non canon. And no ideas from the Expanded Universe were used as far as I remember. |
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Post by Pinda on Dec 26, 2015 20:45:15 GMT -5
Plagueis is a movie character though. And Sidious thinks he killed him... but we know Plagueis could manipulate life/death... so we don't know if he truly died. Also, the book is no longer canon so we don't know anything about how Plagueis died. Also, some ideas and characters for TFA were based on the Expanded Universe (or so I heard). He's mentioned in Episode 3, given little to nothing on him, yet he was Sidious's master, I think it's entirely plausible for him to make an appearance. I know he died but, is it possible for him to have escaped death? I forgot he was mentioned a tiny bit. But even though he was mentioned, it doesn't make his death in the books non canon. And no ideas from the Expanded Universe were used as far as I remember. The book has been declared non-canon. The new Tarkin book apparently does mention Plagueis though, but everything other than a few lines in that book and ROTS about him is non-canon now. We know Sidious thinks he killed him, but we don't know how and if Sidious is right or not. |
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Post by bane on Dec 26, 2015 20:55:09 GMT -5
I forgot he was mentioned a tiny bit. But even though he was mentioned, it doesn't make his death in the books non canon. And no ideas from the Expanded Universe were used as far as I remember. The book has been declared non-canon. The new Tarkin book apparently does mention Plagueis though, but everything other than a few lines in that book and ROTS about him is non-canon now. We know Sidious thinks he killed him, but we don't know how and if Sidious is right or not. Yeah, after thinking about it, it seems more and more likely in my mind that it's Plagueis. But why was it declared non-canon? And When? I didn't know about that at all. |
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Post by Pinda on Dec 26, 2015 21:14:09 GMT -5
The book has been declared non-canon. The new Tarkin book apparently does mention Plagueis though, but everything other than a few lines in that book and ROTS about him is non-canon now. We know Sidious thinks he killed him, but we don't know how and if Sidious is right or not. Yeah, after thinking about it, it seems more and more likely in my mind that it's Plagueis. But why was it declared non-canon? And When? I didn't know about that at all. Everything made before 2013 other than TCW and the movies was declared non-canon by Disney. |
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Post by bane on Dec 26, 2015 21:38:30 GMT -5
Yeah, after thinking about it, it seems more and more likely in my mind that it's Plagueis. But why was it declared non-canon? And When? I didn't know about that at all. Everything made before 2013 other than TCW and the movies was declared non-canon by Disney. maaaaaaaaannnnnnn |
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Post by Ax_Rex on Dec 26, 2015 22:11:56 GMT -5
Yeah, after thinking about it, it seems more and more likely in my mind that it's Plagueis. But why was it declared non-canon? And When? I didn't know about that at all. Everything made before 2013 other than TCW and the movies was declared non-canon by Disney. Disney strikes again! Some of those books and stories were my favourite! Labyrinth of Evil, Darth Plagueis, Tarkin, and a bunch of the dark horse stories... |
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Post by Potato on Dec 26, 2015 22:16:14 GMT -5
It wasn't Disney, it was Lucasfilm... and I think it was a good decision. Even if some of the old canon was good, you can't deny that it was mostly a convoluted mess. Everything's much more organized now. Plus, it's not like they're ignoring the old EU. They're still saving a lot of it and repurposing some of it in new ways.
Like Ben Solo. The character's obviously based off of Han and Leia's son Jacen from the old EU, but the name Ben comes from Luke's son in the old EU. So they're not just throwing it all away.
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Post by Echani on Dec 26, 2015 23:23:22 GMT -5
It wasn't Disney, it was Lucasfilm... and I think it was a good decision. Even if some of the old canon was good, you can't deny that it was mostly a convoluted mess. Everything's much more organized now. Plus, it's not like they're ignoring the old EU. They're still saving a lot of it and repurposing some of it in new ways. Like Ben Solo. The character's obviously based off of Han and Leia's son Jacen from the old EU, but the name Ben comes from Luke's son in the old EU. So they're not just throwing it all away. If I was in charge of Star Wars I would do the same...I mean the amount of errors I would make in the new movies because I have to fact check books and stuff. |
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Post by bane on Dec 26, 2015 23:24:10 GMT -5
Everything made before 2013 other than TCW and the movies was declared non-canon by Disney. Disney strikes again! Some of those books and stories were my favourite! Labyrinth of Evil, Darth Plagueis, Tarkin, and a bunch of the dark horse stories... Out of those I only read Darth Plagueis, but it was a good book. |
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Post by Newan on Dec 27, 2015 0:21:14 GMT -5
Disney strikes again! Some of those books and stories were my favourite! Labyrinth of Evil, Darth Plagueis, Tarkin, and a bunch of the dark horse stories... Out of those I only read Darth Plagueis, but it was a good book. I think that book and basically everything before the movies is still loosely considered canon, there's been some hints from interviews and stuff that I read on the SWTOR forums. The only things that are considered like absolutely not canon are everything post ROTJ and lots of the stuff in between movies |
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Post by Newan on Dec 27, 2015 0:28:24 GMT -5
They should make Thrawn canon again.... It makes sense actually, they would have to alter some things of course to accommodate the sequels but basically Thrawn takes over the empire and launches a ruthless assault against this "New Republic" aka former Rebel Alliance and that is why they're still a resistance and never really got on their feet. It wouldn't conflict much with the sequels actually.
Would make for good spin offs, I always thought Thrawn may have been the best story outside of the movies. Also I think Thrawn is the most well known character outside of the movies as well. In a way those books sort of revived Star Wars when it was at its lowest point between the long gap from ROTJ and TPM when there was almost no new content, it also sparked the entire EU.
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Post by Pinda on Dec 27, 2015 8:59:33 GMT -5
Everything made before 2013 other than TCW and the movies was declared non-canon by Disney. Disney strikes again! Some of those books and stories were my favourite! Labyrinth of Evil, Darth Plagueis, Tarkin, and a bunch of the dark horse stories... Tarkin is canon. |
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Post by Pinda on Dec 27, 2015 9:00:29 GMT -5
It wasn't Disney, it was Lucasfilm... and I think it was a good decision. Even if some of the old canon was good, you can't deny that it was mostly a convoluted mess. Everything's much more organized now. Plus, it's not like they're ignoring the old EU. They're still saving a lot of it and repurposing some of it in new ways. Like Ben Solo. The character's obviously based off of Han and Leia's son Jacen from the old EU, but the name Ben comes from Luke's son in the old EU. So they're not just throwing it all away. Well, it was Disney, as Disney was in charge of Lucasfilm when it happened. But I agree, it was a good decision, the EU was a mess. |
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Post by bobafett590 on Dec 27, 2015 9:28:23 GMT -5
It wasn't Disney, it was Lucasfilm... and I think it was a good decision. Even if some of the old canon was good, you can't deny that it was mostly a convoluted mess. Everything's much more organized now. Plus, it's not like they're ignoring the old EU. They're still saving a lot of it and repurposing some of it in new ways. Like Ben Solo. The character's obviously based off of Han and Leia's son Jacen from the old EU, but the name Ben comes from Luke's son in the old EU. So they're not just throwing it all away. If I was in charge of Star Wars I would do the same...I mean the amount of errors I would make in the new movies because I have to fact check books and stuff. But there was already a system in place to circumvent that problem. In the old system, movies, their novelizations, TCW and Rebels were classified as "G-Canon" which meant that their stories took automatic precedence over the EU (which was rated as lower canon). Content that was completely overwritten was relegated to N-Canon (most of the goofy EU that people criticise was put into N-Canon so the "EU was stupid" argument doesn't really wash). The process of relegating an EU story to N-Canon was automatic as well. They didn't/wouldn't need to "fact check books" at all. If it unambiguously contradicted G-Canon it went straight in the N-Canon bin. Was there a big announcement when the Barriss stories were overwritten in TCW? No, because it didn't need to be said as it was auto-overwritten. Either Disney didn't understand that system (unlikely) or they wanted to rewrite the franchise in their own image. The latter seems more likely. (To address Potato 's point, Lucasfilms did the retcon, but they are owned by Disney and Disney authorised the decision). The only EU stories that make sense being retconned are the post-ROTJ era stories and EU in the Rebels era (5 BBY-0 BBY) because they interfere directly with new content we know Disney are releasing/want to release but even then they should try to keep the best stories mostly intact if they can (to be fair, they are doing this with some stories/characters). My point is if the old system was still in place we would still have pre-Phantom Menace and other EU whilst also having the EU that interferes with the new movies made non-canon if necessary. That is not to say this change will be a total disaster and I'll admit, this new system could definitely change Star Wars for the better if done right . Like if Disney decides to bring the sensible and better EU stories back into canon while leaving the dumb stories as non-canon, I'll be happy. I just hope this isn't Disney throwing the baby out with the bathwater. |
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Post by Newan on Dec 27, 2015 11:37:26 GMT -5
Also about what I said with Thrawn earlier, it make a lot of sense as I find it very unbelievable that Snoke just somehow took over the Empire and remade it right away
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Post by Ax_Rex on Dec 27, 2015 12:38:45 GMT -5
Disney strikes again! Some of those books and stories were my favourite! Labyrinth of Evil, Darth Plagueis, Tarkin, and a bunch of the dark horse stories... Out of those I only read Darth Plagueis, but it was a good book. Labyrinth of Evil is my all time favourite! |
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Post by Echani on Dec 27, 2015 13:45:20 GMT -5
If I was in charge of Star Wars I would do the same...I mean the amount of errors I would make in the new movies because I have to fact check books and stuff. But there was already a system in place to circumvent that problem. In the old system, movies, their novelizations, TCW and Rebels were classified as "G-Canon" which meant that their stories took automatic precedence over the EU (which was rated as lower canon). Content that was completely overwritten was relegated to N-Canon (most of the goofy EU that people criticise was put into N-Canon so the "EU was stupid" argument doesn't really wash). The process of relegating an EU story to N-Canon was automatic as well. They didn't/wouldn't need to "fact check books" at all. If it unambiguously contradicted G-Canon it went straight in the N-Canon bin. Was there a big announcement when the Barriss stories were overwritten in TCW? No, because it didn't need to be said as it was auto-overwritten. Either Disney didn't understand that system (unlikely) or they wanted to rewrite the franchise in their own image. The latter seems more likely. (To address Potato 's point, Lucasfilms did the retcon, but they are owned by Disney and Disney authorised the decision). The only EU stories that make sense being retconned are the post-ROTJ era stories and EU in the Rebels era (5 BBY-0 BBY) because they interfere directly with new content we know Disney are releasing/want to release but even then they should try to keep the best stories mostly intact if they can (to be fair, they are doing this with some stories/characters). My point is if the old system was still in place we would still have pre-Phantom Menace and other EU whilst also having the EU that interferes with the new movies made non-canon if necessary. That is not to say this change will be a total disaster and I'll admit, this new system could definitely change Star Wars for the better if done right . Like if Disney decides to bring the sensible and better EU stories back into canon while leaving the dumb stories as non-canon, I'll be happy. I just hope this isn't Disney throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Dang, didn't know that. That seems like a smart system actually.. |
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Post by Pinda on Dec 27, 2015 15:08:09 GMT -5
This video gives all arguments in favour and against the Plagueis theory.
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Post by bobafett590 on Dec 27, 2015 19:45:16 GMT -5
Maybe I'm the only one who thinks this. But for me as soon as Kylo Ren took off his mask he ceased to be intimidating and it was hard to treat him as a menacing villain like Vader. You need a villain like Vader to focus on and Snoke hasn't been developed enough for me to count him as a centre-stage villain. Hopefully Kylo improves over time and Snoke turns out to be a good villain.
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Post by Pinda on Dec 27, 2015 19:55:42 GMT -5
Maybe I'm the only one who thinks this. But for me as soon as Kylo Ren took of his mask he ceased to be intimidating and it was hard to treat him as a menacing villain like Vader. You need a villain like Vader to focus on and Snoke hasn't been developed enough for me to count him as a centre-stage villain. Hopefully Kylo improves over time and Snoke turns out to be a good villain. I think the point is to not have Kylo feel like a true villain (like Vader or Sidious) but more like a character with a bit more depth. So I think showing his face was a good idea, it means he is not just another Darth Vader, but a better developed character from the beginning. |
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Post by ?6 (CBK) on Dec 28, 2015 9:27:52 GMT -5
I don't get why TOR isn't considered canon. It doesn't interfere with anything. :/
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Post by Newan on Dec 28, 2015 12:52:58 GMT -5
I don't get why TOR isn't considered canon. It doesn't interfere with anything. :/ Actually SWTOR itself (not sure about KOTOR or anything) is in a very interesting spot, it isn't considered "canon" like everything else that is canon but it also isn't considered "legends" exactly like all the old post ROTJ stuff. There have been lots of threads on SWTOR.com from various sources about the canon state of the game. It's actually quite possible it will be made canon. Also SWTOR is actually the only thing still running from pre-Disney days. |
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Post by The Jawa Juicer on Dec 28, 2015 22:50:14 GMT -5
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Post by The Jawa Juicer on Dec 29, 2015 13:43:33 GMT -5
crackpot theory time!
Rey is the bastard grandchild of Kenobi and Satine
Rey is a clone of anakin with a switched chromosome
Phasma is a Jango clone with a switched chromosome
Phasma is Boba Fett's kid
Snoke is Jar Jar
Hux is Tarkin's grandchild
Maz Kanata is Snoke
Phasma's armor is actually made of cortosis and in the next film she will grab a lightsaber in midair or something cool like that
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Post by Pinda on Dec 29, 2015 14:25:51 GMT -5
This track sounds a lot like the separatist music from the prequels.
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Post by Potato on Dec 29, 2015 15:33:55 GMT -5
That and Rey's theme are my favorite soundtracks.  |
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Post by Newan on Dec 29, 2015 17:12:19 GMT -5
Ahh yes that's the Indiana Jones like track from The Last Crusade
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Post by Ivar-Jedi on Dec 29, 2015 19:49:22 GMT -5
That and Rey's theme are my favorite soundtracks. Rey's theme is wonderful! |
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Post by Potato on Jan 1, 2016 14:06:35 GMT -5
LOL, have you guys heard about TR-8R? If not then look him up... he's spread like wildfire across the internet. |
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Post by bane on Jan 1, 2016 16:33:08 GMT -5
LOL, have you guys heard about TR-8R? If not then look him up... he's spread like wildfire across the internet. Everyone loves him |
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Wars Story
But even though he was mentioned, it doesn't make his death in the books non canon. 
it’s been quite a while. I’ve been pretty good, how about yourself? 