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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 7, 2019 13:03:17 GMT -5
Here is Season Five! And the arc that got pushed back a week because apparently, it wasn't exciting enough. These next three aren't the most popular arcs, probably because they go on too long. Do they deserve it or are they better binged?
February 8th - 14th 2019
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 7, 2019 13:06:35 GMT -5
I'm probably not gonna watch these until later. Got all the tests next week.
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Post by Newan on Feb 7, 2019 16:23:18 GMT -5
So far behind now.... been working nearly 40 hours as week lately
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 7, 2019 17:49:13 GMT -5
So far behind now.... been working nearly 40 hours as week lately Afraid the next few arcs might not provide a whole lot of motivation.
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Post by Star on Feb 7, 2019 20:37:33 GMT -5
I don't think I ever rewatched this arc or the next two... From what I recall, this one is fine, but the Youngling and D-Squad arcs are bloated.
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 15, 2019 19:56:20 GMT -5
Watching the first episode. Where the hell did they get a Separatist Tank to practice on? Did they steal it? Did they buy it from a Droid? idk.
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 15, 2019 19:59:04 GMT -5
I don’t think I’ve watched this since it came out. I forgot Ahsoka and Steela even had a rivalry thing going.
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 16, 2019 18:52:01 GMT -5
A War On Two Fronts is a solid if unremarkable. It's a cool idea to see Jedi trying to discreetly organize rebels, even if it doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I'm not sure where they got all those droidekas and AAT's but alright. It is cool to see the strategies they've picked up. Also cool to see Rex in his only substantial appearance this season.
As for the characters, they're okay. Lux is definitely much better here than he's ever been. Probably because he's been a smug little shit up to this point. But he almost feels like a completely different character. Saw is kinda abrasive and annoying though and I didn't really have strong feelings about Steela either way in this episodes.
The pacing is pretty slow but it's alright since it's just a Part 1.
I'm gonna give this a 7/10. Pretty good start and can't really fault it for anything.
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 16, 2019 19:19:30 GMT -5
Front Runners underwhelms a bit in my opinion. The attacks on droids at the beginning feel a little bit silly and don't flow all that well. And they really do make the rebels look more like hooligans than actual freedom fighters (believe it or not, they made a whole show like that later)
I liked what we saw of Iziz in the last episode, but here it feels a bit blander. It doesn't feel as populous as it should at some points, and sometimes that lowers the weight of what they're doing. The attack on the iDroid Charger disappoints because while it's supposed to feel like a huge victory and inspiring moment, only like half a dozen people see it. If it had been a crowd at the end, it could have been epic.
Also, we get the two kings. I'm not exactly sure why Dendup is kept alive but these two characters are too cliche for me to ask a whole lot of questions.
And then we get the kinda weird moment at the end. Like the episode ends on Steela epically revealing Saw is her brother. Like I'm not sure what we're supposed to take away from this. I don't know if I knew they were related when I first saw this but even if not, then what? Was Ahsoka hoping they'd pair off so she could get Lux? And so we're supposed to be sad bc they probably aren't into that Ilhan Omar shit and Steela will get Lux? I don't know.
This episode isn't bad, but just a bit meandering and weird in places. I'll give it a 6/10.
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 16, 2019 20:00:54 GMT -5
The Soft War is a bit better, as it has a deal more tension.
First off though, Kalani doesn't really live up to the hype. Not much is done to show him as effective or worthy of the Darth Maul like introduction he got last week.
Saw gets a bit better here. His lines are a bit cheesy and cliche but at least he's not a dick in this episode. The kings are about the same though. I wish Rash, in particular, had more of a character beyond general douchebag. Something more could've been done with him.
Speaking of the kings, this whole situation is kinda confusing. Apparently, when the CIS took Onderon, Rash was appointed King. But Mina Bonteri represented Onderon in the Senate long before this, so Rash must've been in power for a while. Why were they just striking then? And if he'd been there all that time, Lux and his mom must have been fine with him in Season 3. If you look at this timeline, Rash had usurped Dendup years ago and Lux didn't care until this arc. I don't know, just a bit weird.
The episode is kinda predictable, especially Tandin's turn. The only surprising thing is that no one of importance dies. The ending scene is fine but it's a bit repetitive with three different rescues over the course of a few minutes. Also it might have been smart to take Rash hostage or kill him.
It's fine and a bit better than the last one but still not great. 6.5/10
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Post by Spidyyr on Feb 16, 2019 20:21:45 GMT -5
Whenever they showed Onderon footage in the Season 5 trailers, it was always from Tipping Points. And it's easy to see why. Tipping Points is easily the best episode in the arc. There's a lot of cool things here, from the rough setting, cool new droids, Hondo, and a shocking death that added a lot to the arc.
In a way, this episode makes the last three episodes feel worth it, even though they weren't always that good. This arc probably could've been taken down to three episodes with some rewrites. But this episode makes you forget all the shit you didn't like and ends it on a definite high. It's the opposite of "Crisis on Naboo."
None of the characters annoy me in this one. Even Saw is pretty cool here. It's interesting as he says "it's war" as a justification for possibly killing innocent civilians. It's surprising that someone who's supposed to be a good guy says that. As for Lux, it's kinda surprising of how little consequence he is throughout this arc. You could probably remove him and it would barely make a difference. But well at least he's not screwing shit up with stupidity anymore so I'll take it. Now that I think about it, Saw is in many ways what Lux could've been if he continued down the vengeful path but was still less of a bitch.
There's not a whole lot to say about Ahsoka here as she's kept out of the action and honestly doesn't have many meaningful interactions until the end.
Steela is at her best here. I do like the determination she has to win and to protect the King. She became more calm and levelheaded as the arc went on and grew into her role. As for her death, I really think it works. Up to this point, there had been very little cost and it felt like the Onderon Scooby Gang would all have a happy ending. I like how they remind the audience of the real cost of war. It adds a very good layer to the episode that improves the whole arc in retrospect. There's a great poignancy to her death and it's a bold note to leave on.
Also glad Hondo was in this one. The timing is a bit odd though. Anakin flies from the Core to the Outer Rim and Hondo goes from the Outer Rim to the Inner Rim and barely any time seems to pass. It's not Game of Thrones Season 7 bad, but it sticks out.
The Droid Gunships are also much appreciated. It's a shame they turned out to be the coolest droid introduced here and not Kalani but oh well. But Kalani does good his moment of casually executing Rash. I like that end for him.
This episode is surprising in how well it works, especially given the forgettable nature of the last three. It's a very strong end and one I'm comfortable giving an 8.5/10.
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Post by Star on Feb 28, 2019 10:32:12 GMT -5
Finally got around to Onderon. There were a lot of small things I forgot about this arc.
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Post by Star on Feb 28, 2019 10:42:47 GMT -5
We open up with the Jedi discussing the idea of arming local groups hostile to the Separatists on CIS-occupied worlds. The concept is pretty interesting, and sets the stage for an arc that is much more relatable to our current society than most other stories on this series.
Although it is kind of slow to watch, seeing the Jedi and Rex train the rebels is cool. I think these scenes do just enough to get the point across and showcase the characters without becoming too tiresome. Lux is much more tolerable here than before, and if not for his previous iterations, I probably wouldn't overthink how he is in this arc. However, his voice is still off-putting and some of what he actually says is strange. Saw, surprisingly, is not very likable as a character in this part of the arc. They really aim for an arrogant and rash figure, but I think this choice sits better upon viewing the entire story. Steela is definitely the strongest character of the trio, and this one does a good job of setting up where her character goes in the subsequent episodes.
The jungle setting on Onderon is very immersive and looks great with the noticeable animation improvement in S5. Although the droid attack at the end doesn't feel super threatening, it does give the insurgents their final push to start toward the bigger goal. There's not much in A War on Two Fronts that is bad, but nothing really stands out either. Given it's only the first part of four though, that's not a terrible thing. The overall story is still somewhat fun. I'll go with 7/10.
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Post by Star on Mar 2, 2019 14:01:13 GMT -5
Front Runners is kind of a strange episode, especially since it feels the most like a link between the two halves of the arc. It certainly delivers more action, but large portions of the action don't feel to hold much weight. Seeing more of the city is nice, but it doesn't feel as bustling as expected. Getting introduced to Rash and Dendup here is neat. It doesn't seem to make much sense why Dendup is still alive, but Rash also seems too foolish to be in charge, so I'm not questioning it that much. I wish this episode also introduced Tandin versus waiting until next episode.
When Obi-Wan, Anakin, and Rex all leave, it makes their presence from the first part of the arc feel kind of useless, since they're leaving so soon. However, it does give Ahsoka a chance to become more independent, even if the attention is mostly on the main trio. The relationship between her, Steela, and Lux is still kind of weird here, but it doesn't detract from the overall story. Steela's "grand reveal" of Saw as her brother doesn't make much sense to me though, since it's played out like some major revelation.
Again, this episode is fine, but it does feel odd individually. A lot of it is setting up the next two episodes, which is okay, but there's nothing that elevates this one over the previous part for me. Another 7/10.
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Post by Star on Mar 3, 2019 14:42:52 GMT -5
Everything gets taken up a notch in The Soft War. The opening sequence is really neat, and I like the small speech Steela delivers. It's interesting that the rebels used actual grenades in that ambush versus droid poppers though. The scene in the palace is nice as well, since we meet Kalani and Tandin. I think their tense relationship works well throughout this episode, particularly during the torture scene. However, if we had known Tandin earlier, it would've been even better.
Tandin's turn from King Rash to the insurgents feels natural, but it would've been more effective if we had seen him do more as a "villain" beforehand. On another note, it seems really risky to keep Dendup imprisoned on an open rooftop area of the palace, even if there is a one way shield.
The whole execution scene unfolds nicely, with the continuous camera shot of the rebels running into that skirmish adding to the intensity. I thought it was neat to see Ahsoka struggling to decide what course of action to take throughout this sequence as well. My main complaint is it's a little underwhelming how easy it seems to defeat King Rash and the others. Also, it's odd they chose not to take Rash hostage or destroy Kalani.
The characters develop nicely in this episode, especially Saw and Steela. Lux feels somewhat unimportant unfortunately, but I think the way the relationship between Ahsoka and Lux is handled throughout this arc is not as bad as some people make it to be. In fact, I think it's an interesting and important development for Ahsoka's character to sort out her feelings. Iziz looks great visually, and I personally think it's a really cool setting. I've also loved this arc's usage of robes/cloaks.
A lot of the groundwork laid is now starting to pay off, making this episode the strongest yet of the arc. 8/10.
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Post by Star on Mar 3, 2019 15:16:15 GMT -5
Tipping Points presents a very strong finish to an arc that is not among my favorites. Within a few minutes, the climatic struggle between the rebels and Separatists begins, and it is so fun to watch. We get some soldiers charging into the fray, others flying above, and the rest fighting from behind cover. The way this battle is executed feels so unique, and its combination of really cool camera angles and a rugged landscape further enhance it.
I didn't realize until the rewatch, but seeing the official introduction of Droid Gunships into the war was great. They also gave a logical purpose for Hondo to appear in the episode. Even though he's only around for a handful of minutes, he works excellently here and adds to the fun. It was a bit odd how quickly he came to the aid of the rebels, but it's not enough to detract from my overall enjoyment.
The way Steela's death occurs is really well-done I think. I feel like this arc sets up Saw, Dendup, or even Lux as more likely to die. However, those final moments with her are so tense and powerful, aided by the fact she was probably the best written character of the trio.
Even though Ahsoka doesn't have a huge role here, I think this episode ties her story in this arc together nicely. It provides some sense of closure for her interest with Lux, and allows her to see her biggest solo mission come to a successful end. In a more subtle way, this story developed her a lot. Tipping Points had pretty good pacing and packed quite a punch to end the Onderon arc. This is a strong 8.5/10 for me.
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Post by Newan on Nov 19, 2019 11:03:52 GMT -5
A War on Two Fronts is better than I remembered and probably one of the best episodes in the first half of season 5. I liked that it featured Anakin and Rex as well, we barley get to see them in season 5. This episode has a nice charm to it and Onderon is also fairly atheistically pleasing. It’s quite ironic though that future Darth Vader is training Rebels and someone like Kenobi is against it.
Lux is still an annoying character and the love triangle is kind of unneeded... could have made Ahsokas love interest more interesting but I’m glad that Anakin obviously takes notice to it while Kenobi seems to be as dense as ever.
Anyways I’m gonna say 7/10, it’s simple yet very charming and it gave hope that season 5 was heading in a decent direction, oh how we were wrong.
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Post by Newan on Nov 19, 2019 11:33:30 GMT -5
Honestly Front Runners ain’t that great... after what a day of training and a couple days against small groups of patrols they are now expert combatants? They deal with droids better than most clones already. I also felt like the episode is so fast, the public’s perception changes rapidly and overall everything just feels too easy. This episode almost devalues the previous one because it seems like Anakin, Kenobi and Rex just dont matter all that much like Star said.
The whole brother revelation at the end seems kind of pointless and doesn’t carry any weight, honestly I forgot that was devalued mid arc, I actually just thought it was common knowledge from the start. It seems like the brother/ sister dynamic only matters post clone wars for Saw as his extremism later on is often anger over his sisters death.
I’m gonna give this one a 6/10, it’s ok but nothing special just fairly average honestly, in a perfect season/ world this would be the lowest the quality should get but obviously season 5 has much to say about that.
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Post by Newan on Nov 19, 2019 12:06:09 GMT -5
The Soft War is definitely better than Front Runners but I’m starting to see a pattern in these season 5 arcs that the later episodes just don’t feel very connected to the start of the arc other than introducing a few new characters. It’s the flaw of these 4 part arcs when they don’t have exceptional stories to guide them. Even looking at something like the Deception arc the goal was clear from episode 1, stop the chancellor from being killed/ captured. The deception arc flows fluidly from my memory but I haven’t rewatched it yet.
I also don’t like that the General is basically first seen now, he should have been established a bit earlier. Dendam also doesn’t have much development prior to this episode. Oh and Kalani just doesn’t seem that menacing here but I feel like that’s cause they made these Rebels way too strong in a short period of time.
Still I enjoyed the buildup of this episode and the action was decent so I’m gonna say borderline 7/10. Not amazing but an improvement.
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Post by Newan on Nov 19, 2019 12:35:41 GMT -5
Tipping Points is a satisfying conclusion to this story. Although I almost feel like someone should have died at the end of The Soft War during the rescue to give the conflict more depth and higher risk. But Steelas death here was fairly well done even if I never cared for her character all that much. The inclusion of the Gunship was a nice touch and the Hondo cameo felt appropriate. This episode and Revival are the only places I feel like Hondo was needed in season 5. He was unnecessary in the youngling arc for the most part. I enjoyed the action in this episode however I have mixed feelings overall with the arc. On one hand it’s neat to explore a scenario where clones are not the main combatants and regular people are fighting the droids however it’s just... not as interesting as one might think One thing I must give credit for is that the writers stayed true to Onderons deep lore around hunting and beasts. There was a lot of cool and unique creatures in this arc which is what Onderon is known for Anyways I’m gonna say 8/10, it’s nothing super great but it’s enjoyable. Still when you think back to this taking a month to fully release it’s still kind of disappointing, being stuck on one story for so long when it’s not 100% engaging was just boring.
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Post by Newan on Nov 19, 2019 12:36:16 GMT -5
Final arc score is 28/40 or 70%.
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Post by Spidyyr on Nov 19, 2019 23:25:52 GMT -5
They released clips from “Tipping Points” back before the season premiered. And all the Onderon shots in the trailers were of that final battle.
Kinda shows that even they knew how boring the rest of the arc was. I expected it to be a battle arc through and through but instead we mostly got what felt like a Rebels back door pilot.
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Post by Spidyyr on Nov 19, 2019 23:27:47 GMT -5
It feels like with both Season 3 and 5, the writers were really excited for the back half, so they really just neglected the fall episodes.
Even worse with Season 5 IMO. Season 3 had some shit that didn’t work at the beginning but at least it felt like they were taking risks. Season 5 on the other hand felt so generic and like they were playing it safe with stuff like Younglings and Droids.
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Post by Newan on Nov 20, 2019 10:50:53 GMT -5
It feels like with both Season 3 and 5, the writers were really excited for the back half, so they really just neglected the fall episodes. Even worse with Season 5 IMO. Season 3 had some shit that didn’t work at the beginning but at least it felt like they were taking risks. Season 5 on the other hand felt so generic and like they were playing it safe with stuff like Younglings and Droids. I wonder if we really researched who wrote every episode/ arc we could find a trend of who the meh writers are and who the good ones are. I know Katie Lucas was well known for good arcs.
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Post by Spidyyr on Nov 20, 2019 12:46:04 GMT -5
It feels like with both Season 3 and 5, the writers were really excited for the back half, so they really just neglected the fall episodes. Even worse with Season 5 IMO. Season 3 had some shit that didn’t work at the beginning but at least it felt like they were taking risks. Season 5 on the other hand felt so generic and like they were playing it safe with stuff like Younglings and Droids. I wonder if we really researched who wrote every episode/ arc we could find a trend of who the meh writers are and who the good ones are. I know Katie Lucas was well known for good arcs. That's an interesting thing to look at
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Post by Spidyyr on Nov 20, 2019 12:50:38 GMT -5
Just looked on the wikipedia page. In later seasons, episodes in a single arc seemed to all be written by the same person. But earlier on the writer would change throughout.
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Post by Spidyyr on Nov 20, 2019 12:52:46 GMT -5
The Onderon Arc was written by Chris Collins. He also wrote the Darth Maul/Death Watch arc. Since then, he cowrote John Wick 3.
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